Maverick Veterans’ Voices: Interview with Mark Graves

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Interviewee: Mr. Mark Graves

Interviewer: Melissa Gonzales

Date of Interview: April 30, 2013

Location of Interview: Arlington, Texas

Transcriber: Diane Saylors

Special Collections UTA Libraries

GONZALES: This is Melissa Gonzales. Today is Tuesday, April 30, 2013. I am interviewing Mr. Mark Graves for the first time. This interview is taking place at the University of Texas at Arlington Central Library located in Arlington, Texas. This interview is sponsored by the College of Liberal Arts and is part of the Maverick Veterans' Voices Project.

GONZALES: So where are you originally from?

GRAVES: I'm originally from Norwich, New York. It's upstate New York. We like to call it the home of Pepto-Bismol. That's where it was founded.

GONZALES: Did you have family members who had been in the military?

GRAVES: I had. My father was in the Air Force. An uncle on my mother's side was 00:01:00also in the Air Force, and then I currently have a brother who is at Fort Stewart, Georgia with the Army.

GONZALES: Did you participate in the Air Force ROTC either in high school or college?

GRAVES: No.

GONZALES: So was there a particular incident or person who influenced your decision to join the Air Force?

GRAVES: My father was my biggest influence. When I was getting ready to graduate from high school just coming up on graduation, I knew at that time academically there was no way I could go to college. So I wanted to be a police officer, and my dad just told me, he says, "Well, go in the Air Force." We had other friends that had been in the military that said the same thing. Go in the Air Force, get your basics out of the way while you're in. You got good experience when you get out in four years, then you'll be old enough to become a police officer.

And with me, it was kind of neat. It was the tail end of my junior year in high school, and I spoke to a recruiter that day. I came home and gave my father the 00:02:00sheet of paper and asked him to sign it, and he says, "What's this?" I said, "Well, it's a permission slip from you for me to test and take a physical for the Air Force." He looked up at me, he looked down at the sheet of paper and had a tear in his eye and said, "This is what you really want to do?" I said, "Yes, it is." He immediately signed it.

GONZALES: So you had full support from your family?

GRAVES: Yes.

GONZALES: So you said you graduated from high school and then joined the Air Force.

GRAVES: Yes.

GONZALES: Where did they send you to training?

GRAVES: Well--just to go back with what you just said. I graduated from high school June 22, and I actually was sworn in on a delayed enlistment program June 19. So I was officially a member of the Air Force before I graduated from high school, and then five months later I went for active duty. I went to Lackland Air Force Base in San Antonio, Texas, which is the only basic training base the Air Force has. They used to have three many, many years ago, but now Lackland is 00:03:00the only military training base.

GONZALES: So, what was a day like during training?

GRAVES: We'd get up, as they used to say, at 0 dark thirty. (laughs) It was very rigorous. I mean, in the Air Force about 80 percent of your training is academic. But we were up at four-thirty every morning. We had to get our dorm ready. They called them dorms. I was in a barracks. I was still in one of the old two-story wooden clapboard buildings. But we'd get up. We'd head over, have our breakfast, and then we'd be off to class. Usually, around mid-day just before lunch, we would have our exercise. That's when we'd have our PT. Then from there, we'd have our lunch.

There'd be other things throughout the day besides academics. You know, like going to the confidence course, which is usually towards the end of basic training. But, yeah, it's primarily academic, you know, like I said, with a lot 00:04:00of other things, shooting the rifle.

I did have a story that was really kind of neat for me. When I was in basic training, my father and my uncle both told me, "When you go into basic training, do not volunteer for anything." So I said, "Okay."

Well, we got there and it was probably around the fourth week, and my basic training was six weeks long. And our drill instructor, or TI as they called them, said, "Okay, I need twenty volunteers for this evening." Our flight commander, he steps up and he says, "What are we volunteering for, sir?" And he says, "You'll find out as soon as I get my twenty volunteers." So guys were slowly raising their hands, and the guy next to me says, "Come on, Graves." He says, "Go ahead, let's volunteer. We'll do it together," and I said, "No. I was told never to volunteer. I'm not volunteering." I kept at it--

Finally, I was twentieth volunteer. I said, "Alright. I'll do it." I 00:05:00volunteered, and our TI said, "Okay. For those of you who showed the enthusiasm to volunteer, make sure you have your blues in order tonight because you will be getting on a bus around five o'clock heading downtown to watch the San Antonio Spurs basketball game. For those of you that did not have the enthusiasm to volunteer, KP duty tonight. Be at the kitchen at six o'clock." (laughs)

GONZALES: So that's--it worked out for you.

GRAVES: Yes, it worked out for me.

GONZALES: Did you have any influential instructors or mentors during that time?

GRAVES: I had one instructor in basic training. Sgt. Carrick was his name. I had three instructors throughout. Our main--what we called Team Chief, I can't remember his name, and we were his last flight because he was retiring as soon as we graduated.

Then I had two others, Sgt. Garza and Sgt. Carrick. Sgt. Carrick was more of a mentor to me at that time primarily because I was going into the Security Forces career field and he was former Security Forces. And he was a K-9 handler, and he 00:06:00chose to go into TI duty, and so that's how I got to know him.

We got to know each other pretty well with one incident when I was standing outside of the PT field watching other guys do their PT. Some of us were talking. We could--we could talk and just say a few jokes or whatever. Somebody said something and I kind of chuckled, and I looked over at the PT field. I'm squinting because the sun's right in my eyes, and the drill instructor from one of those flights over there yelled. He said, "You get over here!" And we're all looking at each other, and he just says, "You!" And we're still looking--we don't know who he's talking to. "You, third one in line." So I run over and I do my usual. I said, "Sir! Yes, Sir!" Says, "Were you laughing at my men?" I said, "No, Sir." "Are you calling me a liar?" "No, Sir." "You were laughing at my men!" "No, Sir." This went on for just a couple of minutes and finally, he says, "Get out of my face!" So I ran back to my place.

Well, my TI, Sgt. Carrick, he calls me over, and he starts going up one side and down the other saying I'm embarrassing him. And he says, "Give me a 341," which is a small form that we always kept in our pockets. It was basically a form that was to be used for counseling if you did things bad that could also be used for counseling if you did things really good. So I handed him my 341, and he says, "I want to see you in my office when we get back."

Well, we got back, and I went up there. When you would knock on the door, you knock one time. You knock as hard as you can and you try to splinter the wood if you can. So he calls me in and tells me to close the door. I reported, "Airman Graves reports as ordered, Sir." He looks at it and he says, "What happened?" And so I told him, and he says, "I can't believe that. Here's your 341 back." My flight commander, he's standing outside knocking on the door, and he says, "Wait just a minute. I've really got to do this for him." So he yelled and cussed and told me to leave as quick as possible and he didn't want to see me in his office ever again. Well, then he read the riot act to the flight commander, and I mean, I felt great. (laughs)

GONZALES: You mentioned Security Forces.

GRAVES: Um-hmm.

GONZALES: Is that what you went into after training?

GRAVES: Yeah. After basic training, there is a technical school, which is where you go to learn your particular job in the Air Force. And this is the recruiter's side of me talking because I was a recruiter for many years, but everyone goes to basic training first. At the end of basic training, then they're going to go into a career field. A lot of jobs are guaranteed prior to people going into the Air Force. So they know exactly where they're going to go and what they're going to do, how long they're going to be gone for training after the basic training was completed. There's others that they may have qualified for certain jobs but they may not have been open at that time, so they may have gone to what they called open general, open mechanics, or electronics.

I did go in open general trying to get into the Air Force. I'd hurt my knee playing ice hockey while I was in high school. And nothing happened. I mean, it was great, but the doctors at the MEPS thought I had weak knees and they wouldn't let me in initially. A friend of my father's who's an orthopedic surgeon, he's also a retired Air Force doctor, he looked at my knees and he said, "There's nothing wrong with you." Wrote a nice long letter to the people at the MEPS and to the Air Force, and they said, "Come on." But I went down there and I went and spoke to a counselor and my first choice was to go into Security Forces. My second choice was to go into the fire department. That's what my father did in the Air Force. He was in air crash rescue, and so I put that as my second choice.

Well, I got Security Forces. Security Forces my tech school stayed there at Lackland Air Force Base and we did a lot of our training there and then we went out to Camp Bullis because it was the tail end of the Vietnam War. So a lot of what people were still worried about was jungle warfare, so I was trained in 00:09:00jungle warfare. We'd go out into the woods and be playing war games.

GONZALES: You mentioned that your job or career depended upon qualifications. How did they determine those qualifications?

GRAVES: In the Air Force, there's lots of different qualifications. I mean, the first is you have to take what they call the ASVAB test. It's just a written test. It's, I believe, fifteen different sections. It's a timed test. Your overall scores on that test determine academically what jobs you can go into. And then you take the physical examination, and there may be certain things in your physical that will qualify you for some jobs but may not qualify you for others. For instance, if you're colorblind, there's very few jobs you can go into. I had a young kid when I was a recruiter that was colorblind. Based on test scores alone, he qualified for every job in the Air Force. When they 00:10:00determined that he was colorblind, he qualified for three. So it's little things like that.

GONZALES: So what were your responsibilities as part of the Security Forces? So they trained you for jungle warfare, but what were your responsibilities?

GRAVES: My primary responsibilities--when I left Lackland Air Force Base, my first base was Castle Air Force Base, California. We liked to call it, "The gateway to SAC," which is Strategic Air Command. It no longer exists, but that base was the training base for pilots and navigators for B-52s and KC-135 tankers. And the tankers also had what they call a boom operator, which is the one that actually filled the planes in the air. And it was a training base for them.

Our job then was either patrol of the flight line area where the planes were or in some cases, we had to actually stand out in front of an airplane and guard the airplane. Jokingly, we used to say, "I know many rivets are on the B-52," because that's all you could really do. We had entrance gates to the flight line 00:11:00area that were also patrolled by personnel-- So, I would do the--they called it entry controller.

We had a weapons storage area where all the bombs and munitions and bullets were kept, and that was heavily guarded too. We even had signs right on them that said, "Warning! Deadly force authorized," if you decide to enter it unauthorized. But that was primarily--it was patrolling those areas. There's a lot of other jobs that came about. At one point I was asked by one of our people in the head office, he said, "You look pretty good. I'd like to put you on the main gate," and it was a temporary duty assignment. So for three months, my job was working at the main gate waving people through.

And then while I was there also--1976, when the nation was celebrating its two hundredth birthday, the World Bank of London had the Magna Carta or a copy of the Magna Carta flown over, and it was going to be on display at the World Bank 00:12:00of London in San Francisco. We were only about an hour and a half from San Francisco, and so it flew in on a Vulcan bomber, and I was asked if I would like to guard the Magna Carta while it was on base before it left for San Francisco, and I said, "Yes." And a month later when it came back to Castle Air Force Base on its way back, I was asked again if I would like to guard it, so I did. I never actually got to see it but just the idea of knowing that I was there on guard duty for the Magna Carta was something special for me especially as a nineteen-year-old.

GONZALES: Can you describe what Strategic Air Command is?

GRAVES: In the Air Force, there were a lot of different commands. Strategic Air Command, they were primarily a bombing command. Your bombers--long-range bombers, that's Strategic Air Command.

They had what they called the Air Tactical Command, which was your fighters, you know. They had Air Training Command, which is like all your training bases, things like that. Mobility Command, that's your airlift, if you're going to ship somebody somewhere or ship supplies, that's how. Those were the commands. They've consolidated a lot of those now. Now it's Air Education and Training Command, which is all your training, your colleges because the Air Force is the only branch that has its own university, Air University, and then Community College of the Air Force.

The Strategic Air Command and Air Training Command were consolidated into the Air Combat Command. Then the Air Mobility Command, that's as an--well, I think it was Military Airlift Command at that point, and now it's the Air Mobility Command.

GONZALES: Do you recall your first days in the service, that transition from civilian to military?

GRAVES: That was a long, long time ago. Yeah, it was scary at first. I mean, fear of the unknown, just like anything. It was probably not as frightful as my 00:14:00first day on the job here at the University, but yeah, you never know what to expect. No matter how many horror stories my father and my uncle tried to tell me about what to do to prepare for basic training, nothing's going to prepare you for that.

As a recruiter, one of the things I tried to do with the young troops that I was bringing--both male and female--I would try to prepare them as best that I could on what to look for, and I even had one of my young airmen, after he graduated from tech school, he came home on leave and spent a week with me in my recruiting office. And as parents came in with their son, I remember on one instance, when I was trying to tell them what it was like in basic training, he said, "Listen to Sgt. Graves. He told me exactly what to expect, and I got exactly what I expected based on what he told me." He says, "He is an honest 00:15:00recruiter, and you don't see that or hear that a lot, but he's an honest recruiter."

GONZALES: So I read that you cross-trained into Munitions Systems.

GRAVES: Right.

GONZALES: Can you describe what the class training entailed to prepare you for that role?

GRAVES: There wasn't really anything to tell. What had happened is after my first four years in the Air Force, I got out and I was in a reserve status because my job--I was looking and hoping to become a police officer. And during a Fourth of July service at our church, I was asked to wear my uniform. So I put it on, and I'd been out of the Air Force about two years at that point. So I put it on and it felt good and it still fit.

So I started contemplating because I hadn't heard anything from the police departments or fire departments about being--so I started talking to a recruiter. And he says, "Well, we can get you back in the Air Force, but there are no open positions for Security Forces. Is there anything else that you would 00:16:00like to go into?" and I said, "What do you have available?" He told me that radar technician, and I thought that sounded interesting. I even went to a base and talked to people about radar. And I asked them, I said, "What is the chance of me getting stationed on some mountaintop out in the middle of nowhere?" and he says, "About ninety to one."

So then I walked down to munitions and before I even walked through the gate, I said, "I'll take this job." But now, my brother was in the Air Force at that time, and he was in munitions. He loved it. And I had some interaction with some munitions troops when I was in security forces because I used to guard the weapons storage area. So I knew a little bit about it, and I said, "Sure."

Luckily for me, what I was able to do was I joined the Air National Guard and I went to a base, and that's how I learned my munitions. I didn't have to go to a tech school or anything like that. After nine months, I came back onto active duty. And I was in the munitions career field.

GONZALES: So what was your assignment as part of munitions?

GRAVES: My first assignment, they sent me to Cannon Air Force Base, New Mexico, which is just about ten miles inside of the New Mexico border from Texas in Clovis. I spent fourteen months there. About six months in, I received the orders to go to Misawa, Japan, which is in the very northern part of Japan, so I was looking forward to that. And I thought I had lots of snow in New York. I got to Japan, I found out they average two hundred forty inches of snow a year. So I loved it. I spent four years there.

GONZALES: Was that your first time overseas?

GRAVES: That was my first time overseas at that point, and I got to see the whole Pacific Theater went to Guam; Okinawa; Jakarta, Japan; the Philippines. I went to Korea two or three times, went to Malaysia. That was a lot of fun.

GONZALES: Did the Air Force provide any cultural training to prepare you for that?

GRAVES: Nothing prior to going over. The Misawa Air Base had a program in place for new people coming in. They went through basically a two- week orientation to 00:18:00learn about Japan, learn about the culture, about the base's relationship, and the Air Force's relationship to the Japanese Air Force, and that was pretty much it.

We had civilian wives that were over there. A lot of the military wives taught classes because they'd been there for a while. A lot of the Japanese would come in and actually teach us because the Japanese education programs, you learn a lot of English, so it gave them an opportunity to come on base and speak English. But that was pretty much it. Everything was done right there at the base for us.

GONZALES: How long were you overseas?

GRAVES: I was over there four years.

GONZALES: So other than guarding the Magna Carta, (GRAVES laughs) which is amazing, what are some of your other memorable experiences?

GRAVES: Well, I guess going to Malaysia was quite an experience. We got to see a lot of culture. It was shortly after the Libya bombing when we got there, and we were driving on base and somebody there had a black flag--they knew we were coming--they had a black flag hanging over their banner, said, "Welcome to Libya," but nothing happened. And we just had a good time there, got to see lots of sights over in Pulau Pinang. Lots of jellyfish. It was the first time I'd ever seen a jellyfish.

I deployed to Diego Garcia and I was there when the tsunami hit just a few years ago. But luckily, the island is the top of a volcano, and it sits on what they call a plateau, and all tsunamis travel in the same direction, and it hit that 00:19:00plateau and went right on around us. We never even knew. It wasn't until my wife called in tears wanting to know if I was okay, and we're like, "Yeah, why?" And she told us. She found out in church that a major tsunami hit the Indian Ocean, and she said my pastor took one look at her and thought, Oh, no. What did I just say? because she and Neely got up and ran out, and that's when she called to find out. And like I said, none of us knew anything about it until the next day.

I think one of my most memorable stories was as a recruiter. I had a young gentleman--which I'll get to that age part here in a minute--wanted to go in the Air Force. He was a fully qualified dentist. He'd been in practice for twenty-nine years and sold his practice and wanted to go to England and initially wanted to go into the reserve. Well, when he called our number I said, 00:20:00"Well, we're not reserves. We're active duty. Would you be willing to go into the Air Force on active duty?" he said, "I'm fifty-six years old," and I said, "Okay. Would you like to go on active duty?" and we did a whole package, put everything together, and he was accepted. So as far as I know, I still hold the record of putting the oldest member into the Air Force, and at the time he went on active duty, he was fifty- seven years old. And he went to England just like he wanted to.

GONZALES: I was always under the impression that there was an age limit.

GRAVES: There is, but for medical professionals, there is always exceptions because medical professionals with lots of experience are needed. And most of them, in order to be able to retire, like, as a doctor--in order to be able to retire, you have to be in prior to age forty because, in order to do twenty years to qualify for retirement, they want you to be able to retire by age sixty. You can go by--past the age sixty, but then it's on a year-by-year basis, and it's based on whether you're still qualified both physically and mentally.

GONZALES: You mentioned that you were a recruiter. When did you take on that role?

GRAVES: When I was in Japan, I received what we call a RIP, and it was asking if I would like to go into recruiting duty. I'd never really given it much thought before because my recruiters didn't really prepare me for the Air--my first one especially didn't really prepare me for a life in the Air Force. My second one because I already knew what the Air Force was like, he didn't need to prepare me for anything.

But I said I thought that would be a good unique experience for me. And so I volunteered, and I put down my list of assignments and it came back and said, "Yes. Unanimous you have been selected but none of your assignments are available." Well, being in Japan and being there's a twelve-hour difference, I decided to call San Antonio where the headquarters for recruiting service is, 00:22:00and I told them, I said, "Well, these are assignments that I would like." He said, "Well, let me tell you what we have available," and he went through a couple and he says, "We have Garland, Texas," and I said, "I'm a volunteer for Texas." He says, "You are? Just a minute." Comes back and he says, "You are! You want the job?" I said, "Yes. You said there wasn't anything available." He said, "It came open yesterday." And I said, "Yes, I'll take the assignment, and he says, "Good. You'll have the RIP in ten days."

And then after my four years in Japan, I left for recruiting duty down in San Antonio, and that's an experience just going through the recruiting school because you're being taught how to sell the Air Force, not only to the seventeen- and eighteen-year-olds, but also to their parents, especially those parents that don't have any experience where the military is concerned.

And my time in recruiting, I was very successful primarily--I spent ten years total in recruiting, and seven of those ten years were in medical recruiting. I 00:23:00recruited doctors, I recruited everything in the medical field with the exception of nurses.

GONZALES: And that was the title of Health Professions Recruiting?

GRAVES: Yes.

GONZALES: Okay. And so how long did you do both?

GRAVES: I started off three years in enlisted recruiting because I was in recruiting actually twice. The first time I was in recruiting, I was recruiting high school kids for about eighteen months--no, let me take that back. It was thirteen months and they normally wanted you in high school recruiting for thirty-six months or three years. But because I had some background in medical because I was a first- aid instructor, I was a CPR instructor, and because I was a little older at that time as well, they thought it'd be good to put me into Health Professions recruiting. So I did that.

When I came back into the Air Force the second time, I started off in recruiting, and they went ahead and--no, well, actually, I take that back. When 00:24:00I was in munitions--we'd talked about that--I had transferred over to the reserve in munitions. Well, then an opportunity presented itself for me to come back on active duty, so I did and went into recruiting.

And I had to go through recruiting school again, but I knew what to expect. So it was a lot easier for me, and I came back here to this area, and I was over in Mesquite. From there I moved to Terrell, and I only did that for about eleven months when they said, "We want you back in the Health Professions Recruiting. We're short. We need people. You've got experience." Like I said, in my ten years I did three years in enlisted recruiting and did seven years in officer recruiting or Health Professions.

GONZALES: So while you were overseas, how did you stay in touch with your family?

GRAVES: Well, my wife was with me when I was overseas, but it was primarily phone calls and letters. That's pretty much it. A couple of times I was able to come back on temporary duty back here to the States. I wasn't able to get close enough to home but I was able to call and that's when I talked to them for the most part. It wasn't easy calling back in the early to mid-'80s home like it is today. But that's how I got in touch with them.

GONZALES: Were you able to go on leave at all?

GRAVES: Oh. Oh, yeah. You know, you're authorized thirty days of leave a year in any branch of the military. And when I was in Japan, we would take what they call environmental morale leave, and we didn't actually come back home. It was just too expensive, and, yeah, you can fly military aircraft from Japan to one base here, but then you have to take the civilian aircraft and fly that to go all the way back to New York, but, like I said, I kept in good contact with the 00:25:00family. So I took leave and lots of our leaves we went to Korea a couple of times, went to Okinawa, went to Guam and spent a couple of weeks in Hawaii. That was nice.

GONZALES: So when you returned from being overseas, what did you do to kind of, I guess, get back into being in the States?

GRAVES: Well, you know, just had to kind of reorient myself because I was gone four years and, again, when I came back I was as a recruiter at that point, and so I kind of had to learn our culture all over again because of the Japanese culture.

And I did make one minor mistake one time. Luckily, nothing tragic happened. In Japan, your steering wheel is on the right side of the car, and you drive on the left side of the road. And I knew that when I came back that everything was back 00:26:00to normal and that I shouldn't have a problem. And it wasn't for my first two weeks I was home, and then one day I pulled on the road, and I immediately just pulled right out to the left side of the road and kept ongoing. And finally, my sister who was with me says, "Mark, you're driving on the wrong side of the road," and I said, "Oh. I forgot!" and I moved back over to the right side. About that time a car comes around the hill and we got over just in time, but still, it's just the idea. And I've never had a problem since. (Both laugh)

GONZALES: Were you awarded any medals or citations, and if so how did you receive them?

GRAVES: Nothing for, like, heroism or bravery or anything like that. I received five Commendation Medals while I was in, and primarily that was for my service at certain assignments that--I kept my nose clean, I did my job, went above and beyond in a lot of cases, and I received the Commendation Medal for that.

GONZALES: Did you retire?

GRAVES: Yes. Yeah, with active duty and reserve time, I was a month shy of thirty years when I retired.

GONZALES: How would you say serving in the Air Force affected your life?

GRAVES: Greatly. I believe my service contributed a lot to who I am today. I'm very structured in a lot of the things that I do, and it's the structure of the Air Force that has helped me be who I am today. I try to be very respectful of everybody, and I think that comes with the diversity that you come across in the military. I still stay in contact with lots of friends that I was stationed with while in munitions, while in recruiting even today.

GONZALES: Did you join any veterans' organizations?

GRAVES: Not really, I mean, I'm a part of the Veterans Administration only by virtue of being a disabled vet, but other than that, no. I've gotten invitations to join the American Legion and the VFW, but I haven't. I don't really see a need for me right now at this point in time. So, no.

GONZALES: Do you ever see those old buddies of yours from your time in the Air Force?

GRAVES: I see some of the recruiters that are still in the local area, and like I said I keep in contact with a lot of them through Facebook. And I've still kept in contact with quite a few at Dyess Air Force Base, which was my last base before I retired. And I've got a good friend who worked for me when I was at Dyess, and he's getting ready to retire the first week of June, and I'm going to his retirement ceremony.

GONZALES: So what did you do after you retired?

GRAVES: After I retired, I took a month off, and then I got a job with Dr. Pepper as a sales representative. And while I was a sales rep, I'd go around to different stores, and one of the stores I went to was Walgreen's that was one of my customers. And I started talking to an assistant manager, and they said, You need to become a manager with us. So I interviewed for a job as an assistant manager of Walgreen's and got the job. And it was while I was at Walgreen's that my wife, who's been here at the university for over twenty years, told me of an opening here, and so I applied and got hired here at the university and have been here ever since. It's been a little over three years I've been here at the university.

GONZALES: And what's your official title here?

GRAVES: I'm the Administrative Assistant in the Department of Sociology and Anthropology.

GONZALES: So how would you say your military experience influenced your career or civilian work?

GRAVES: Greatly, especially in my latter years. In recruiting you're not just talking with students, but you're talking with parents. We do that in our departments here at the University. My job deals a lot with the budgets. And when I was in the Air Force, one of the jobs that I had in my squadron at Dyess Air Force Base was the resource manager. I was in charge of credit cards and the squadron budget. So those particular jobs is what really prepared me for my work here.

GONZALES: What advice would you give current cadets here at UTA or the students that would like to join the military?

GRAVES: I think I'd give them the same advice that I gave during my little retirement speech, and it was very short. But I would let them know to, first off, follow your dreams, okay, and what you want to do whether it be in the 00:28:00military or not. But as young troops going in, listen to your supervisors, listen to your commanders because there's a lot of insight and a lot of knowledge that they have that they can give you.

But then I would also tell those supervisors and commanders, listen to your young troops. There's a lot of changes coming. Listen to them and together you can make this a better service, and it doesn't matter whether it's Air Force, Navy, Army, Marine Corps. I believe that they have to work together, but they both need to listen to each other.

GONZALES: Is there anything that you would like to contribute to the interview that I haven't mentioned?

GRAVES: No, other than, I mean, I've thoroughly enjoyed my time in the service. This is the second chapter in my life, and I thoroughly enjoy it now, and I plan to live it the same way I lived my life in the Air Force with all the gusto I 00:29:00can. (Both laugh)

GONZALES: I want to thank you, Mr. Graves, for participating in our Project. You've been very informative and helpful, and I want to thank you for your service and, again, for your contribution to the Maverick Veterans' Voices Project.

GRAVES: Thank you.

GONZALES: Thank you.